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frustrated-client

By Lana M

I had contact today with a person currently on lines in the C of S. The email was just the beginning of many to come, but it has left me with a feeling of complete rage.

Let me explain.

This person (let’s call her Martha) has been with the church for the last 5 years or so and has progressed up through the Grades, all with GAT2. Having only come into the church recently, GAT2 is all she knows and has experienced.

She has been told that GAT2 is wonderful as preclears now get through their Grades rapidly and no longer end up on them “forever”.

But…. in the next sentence she went on to explain how she had wins on her Grades, but they were only wins and not what she had expected or had anticipated.

Yes, she FNed at Exams, but she was not blown out of her socks, nor writing lengthy success stories. She has never run track and has now come up to NED and is bogging.

Then the bombshell was dropped.

She has completed several of her Grades in around 5 hours total each.  She said one of her Grades she completed in a single day, and she did not do an intensive on any of them individually.

I almost fell out of my chair.

“Do you think that is quickie?”, she asked.

I told her that the gains are to be had from doing the Expanded Grades, in full, and it is not about the speed in which Grades are delivered. It is about finding each reading process and running each one to full EP.

Ever since the conversation the significance of it has been something I can’t stop thinking about.

Technical Degrades HCOPL is compulsory as a first issue in EVERY Scientology course — as is KSW 1. Both detail how it is a High Crime and is suppressive to do what now seems to be common place and usual in a Scientology church under GAT2.

The new “normal” in the C of S is that arbitrary processes and requirements have been added to the “SRD”at the bottom of The Bridge which make it impossible for people to ever complete and attest to — and then once they are beaten up, overrun to bejesus and just desperate to get the hell off the rundown, they are put onto quickie Grades that prevent them from achieving and enjoying the incredible gains to be had.

Excuse my language but….. FUCK!!!!!!!

The C of S is not just off-policy and criminal — they are downright squirrel and suppressive!

If there is ANYONE out there who reads this and says — hey, that is what happened to me!..  And I thought Scn was a load of crock and does not work!

Please… contact a reputable auditor in the field and get some real LRH Scientology.  There are real gains to be had. And no — you are not a dog pc, an occluded case or a difficult pc.  You just need real Scientology.

LRH’s kind.

The gains ARE there to be had — and you don’t have to be butchered, introverted and bled dry financially to experience it.

And yes, the Expanded Grades — the LRH Scientology Expanded Grades (not some Dave altered version for GAT2) — will blow your mind and ARE achievable.

My god! This is just outrageous! I will be blowing steam on this for a while.

Jesus!

Dave Miscavige = King Squirrel

69 thoughts on “Quickie degrades

  1. Yup. This has been going on in the CoS for a while, now. In fact, Flag has been promoting and advertising completing the Grades and NED in as little as nine intensives! But even more ludicrous, the CoS now only delivers Quad Grades, not Expanded Grades, unless the person doesn’t have the Grade EP and then they will add more processes to their Grade. So quickie indeed! Violates C/S Series 17 and 77 come to mind right off the bat; and of course, it’s a technical degrade (boasting as to speed of delivery, etc.)

    HCOB 2 APRIL AD15, THE ROAD TO CLEAR:

    “There are about 3 or 4 intensives to a Grade (pc) up to Grade V. That’s perhaps 15 to 20 25-hour intensives.” LRH

    • Makes my blood boil, Chris! I have a full time PC here at the moment, on Expanded Grade Zero. Seeing her enjoying the wins, gains, cogs and releases as we go through the checklist, brings home to me how those in the C of S are getting the short end of the stick and not being given the opportunity to have these gains. The Tone Arm on these Expanded Grades is wonderful and to put someone through the Quad Grades only, and then attest them as complete on the Grade, is such a disservice.
      Argh!!!!!!!!!! $#%@$%!

      • Not only a disservice, Lana, but a tech degrade that will put a stop on their Bridge. Ron mentions on one of the VIII tapes that without the lower grades truly IN, the person won’t make OT. So he’s barring the route out. And yeh, makes the blood boil and the ev purps seem a little more justified. LOL

        • Here’s that reference (one of them, there are a few on those tapes about this):

          “Now, it’s actually just interesting. It doesn’t change anything. It’s where the person is progressing. But, if a person has neglected his grades, lower grades, and neglected C, and hasn’t picked his C up as he comes up through the grades, why when he gets into solo his reality is inadequate, and it is not possible for him to, in actual fact, have any R on III. No reality on III. Well that means he’s out somewhere along the line, don’t you see? He hasn’t made it in that way. And then if you find him hating everybody when he gets to, when he gets to V, or something like this, well you know very well that he actually hasn’t made it there either. These’d just be tests of whether or not the guy has gone. You will find out, oddly enough, that the trouble with cases is a failure to make the grade.” LTJ (Class VIII Tape 1, Welcome To The Class VIII Course)

          • Another:

            “There are no different cases. There are no cases different than any other cases. There aren’t peculiar cases. But I can tell you this, I can tell you this, that a person who does not come up through the grades does not hit the phenomenon. He doesn’t hit the release points of the upper grades if he hasn’t been through the lower grades.” LRH (Class VIII Tape 2, What Standard Tech Does)

    • “CoS now only delivers Quad Grades, not Expanded Grades, unless the person doesn’t have the Grade EP and then they will add more processes to their Grade. ”

      Chris, as a newby auditor can you give me the references on this, as I do not understand what is so wrong with it, IF the EP is attained on the Quad Grade? Is that not possible?

      My understanding of Quad Grades is the Grades audited with the addition of Flow 0 after the Grades had been run with Flows 1,2 and 3 for many years.

      My understanding of The Expanded Grades is the addition of Grades processes per HCOB 25 Jun 70 II so the EP can be achieved.

      Per C/S series 17R Incomplete Cases

      “And so on right on up the Grades, each one done fully to the voluntary declare for that grade as per the Grade and Class Chart.”

      The key words there being “voluntary declare”. Now if I understand correctly PCs can have big wins on the Grades without reaching the EP at which point they should be allowed to go off and have their win, but not attest as there is more to do on that Grade.

      I am not saying the Church is doing this, (ensuring the EPs are achieved). From my own experience, from what Ive read and heard of others and the fact the church is shrinking, at a guess I would say for the sake of stats, wins are being taken as EPs, or people kept on levels way beyond their due time, but that would need to be thoroughly looked into as a case by case action. But what we do know for sure, is that the Tech is not being applied!

      I agree as to boasting as to speed of delivery, it would take an awful lot of mental gymnastics to work with that one for Scientologists still in!

      • 4a,

        By Quad Grades I meant the quad grade process of the grade as per the list in HCOB Mini List of Grade 0-IV Processes, and per the individual process checklists:

        “All the reading processes and flows on this checklist are run on the pc, with the Quad Grade Process and its Havingness Process run last.”

        This is also covered somewhat in C/S Series 93RA, New Grade Chart.

  2. Hi Lana
    you are so right. Even to say D.M. = Squirrel King is an invalidation for Squirrels. Because most Squirrels want to help people with their practices. But D.M., RTC and the men behind (CST, IRS) took over the CoS to avoid making Auditors, to avoid TAA, making Clears and OTs. That is their true and conscious intent. They want to destroy Scientology and do this by altering more and more in small steps so that most on lines do not realize it.
    Let us go back to the roots, to original LRH and have lots of co-auditing and lots of wins.
    Thank you that you are here and communicating the truth!
    Andreas

  3. Re your language (“FUCK!!!!”), it’s duplicated. I’ve been screaming that silently – and sometimes not so silently – ever since I wrote GAT up as a Tech Degrade, got declared, and went onto the internet and saw what was out here. This “narrow line” of standard tech Ron writes about? It’s held by very few people now and is oh so tenuous. Let’s hope that the actions of the few will win out and the tech will be here, unaltered, for our children, their children, and ourselves up the road. Otherwise, we’re FUCKED!

  4. I think this is again very apropos, especially in light of this article:

    “Where does Standard Tech begin? What is it?

    It is the accumulation of those exact processes which make a way between humanoid and OT. The exact method of organizing them, the exact method of delivering them, and the exact repair of any errors made on that route.

    So the net result of all of this is that when it is not standard he will have had some gain; it’s not all bad, but he’ll also have not achieved his full gain.

    And the difference between some gain and the difference between that and full gain, is the difference between wobbly-bobbly tech and very standard, precise tech.” LRH

    Class VIII Tape 2, “What Standard Tech Does” (25 Sep 68)

  5. Getting this person (or others) into a state of doubt about a false attest would be a good thing – it will prevent serious damage (i.e. suicide, cancer, mental derangement, etc) on the upper levels, and not too hard to do:

    “Have you read about independent Scientology online, or critical sites, books or movies?” Extremely unlikely they have, or if they have it is unlikely to have been done directly and not via the church’s false reports, so then follow up: “Did you read this directly or from a church publication?” Keep probing. “Did you share this with anyone at the church?” (Of course not, they will go to ethics). “But aren’t you a communication release, grade 0 who can communicate with anyone about any subject?” They may retaliate and say well I have the freedom to communicate or not to communicate! “True, but then isn’t that a withhold, which is handled on Grade 2?”

    An easier one is, “Don’t you think it is odd that the church sues people outside for practicing what they consider squirrel technology or independent Scientology, when not only the US Constitution protects freedom of religion, but also violates the Creed of the church which allows others to have freedom to believe and communicate?” This may even get doubt on the Happiness Rundown.

    A different method may also work but the point here is to make one see that there is absolutely no way that one can truly attest to the grades promised in the current Church if they are being honest with themselves and others, because they are withholding, not reaching, not communicating and so on – which is exactly the opposite of what is promised. Then maybe they will question if they actually got the EP, or if they got what was promised. It’s just planting seeds, but the whole point of the tech is to question and examine – not blind conformity and cult mentality which is what has occurred especially lately but crept in especially since 1973 onwards.

    • Nah, I don’t think that will work (1st paragraph). Besides, not a good idea to invalidate another’s gains or wins or introvert them into their case (2nd paragraph). Also, unless one has their folder to hand – or was the C/S or auditor – one can’t say if they did or didn’t achieve the EP of the Grade without a good D of P and/or review cycle (last paragraph).

      The whole point of the tech is to increase ability, certainty and knowingness along the dynamics, to the end of playing a better game. 🙂

    • Interestingly Ian, people KNOW that things aren’t right. I just direct people to the MS2 website and this blog so they can get some validation of what they already suspected, felt or knew.

  6. All very interesting, and no doubt about it. I had a strange happening at the gym a few days ago. I started talking with a very nice guy who has been in the Sea Org for a good while. An older guy and an ex pro athlete, and he thought Miscavige was really a good man and doing good things with the tech! It blew my mind! He’s obviously not a trained auditor. But what really blew my mind was that he was talking about the Objectives, which I loved and were like OT sections for me, and took about 10 minutes per Objective. He said that they were now different and some people took as many as 500 hours on them! I knew Miscavige was the super-squirrel SP of all time, but that truly blew my mind! And this guy thought it was great! I guess if you took some homeless druggie on skid row who hadn’t slept or eaten in a week and ran Objectives on him, it could take a while, but 500 hours? Or the “auditor” would have to be a total loser (personally trained by Miscavige). Anyway, just when I thought I had heard it all, this one comes along. But there’s always something to admire, or someone to admire. How about being the biggest SP in the whole universe! Miscavige makes every SP who came before him look downright angelic!

    • Ron pretty much explains what has gone wrong with the Church in KSW:

      When you don’t do Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten actively, you are working for the Bank dominated mob. For it will surely, surely (a) introduce incorrect technology and swear by it, (b) apply technology as incorrectly as possible, (c) open the door to any destructive idea, and (d) encourage incorrect application. It’s the Bank that says the group is all and the individual nothing. It’s the Bank that says we must fail.

      As far as I’m concerned Miscavige is just the embodiment of that above dramatization. Nothing more. Nothing less. And really nothing new.

      Regarding Expanded Grades Vs “Quickie”:

      HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex
      HCO BULLETIN OF 5 APRIL 1977
      EXP ANDED GRADES
      Expanded Grades can be done:
      – After Drug RD
      – After Full Dn RD
      – After Quad Grades
      – After Expanded Dn
      – After Power (but before Solo or Clear or OT I to III and not during these) – After OT III
      – After OT IV
      – After OT V
      – After OT VI
      – After OT VII
      In other words they can be done after any full completion of any one of the above. A typical and IDEAL program for a pc would be:
      – Sub Grade Handling – Drug Rundown
      – Full Dianetics RD
      – Quad Grades
      – Expanded Dn
      – Expanded Grades – Power
      – R6EW
      – Clear
      – OT I
      – OT II
      – OT III
      – OT III X
      – OT IV
      – OT V
      – OT VI
      – OT VII.
      However, due to bit and piece auditing done on some pcs Expanded Grades is sometimes entered at other points.

      Quad Grades (or even Single Grades for that matter) never should have been abandoned and are restored.

      Expanded Grades is NOT a requisite for Power but Quad Grades are.

      Pcs flubbily can be programmed backwards like Expanded Grades, Drug RD, Expanded Dn—etc. etc. But it is far from ideal.

      LRH:dg.nt
      Copyright © 1977
      by L. Ron Hubbard
      ALL RIGHTS RESERVED
      L. RON HUBBARD Founder

      Of course the way the Church is doing this is totally squirrel.

      For instance I know of no reference that says that you run the Quad grade and if you don’t get the full EP you go back and expand it as a standard or usual action.

      Nor what other “EP” they are looking for other than those covered in Dn 55, the HCOB on Flattening a Process or any other ref since written?

      True Ron says in the earlier writings such as COHA that the processes in Route 2 can be run extensively for many hrs and even intensives.

      BTW he also at one time said that these actions could be run on a PC who had gone fully exterior back then!

      But this was in 52 to 54!

      After that came the afore mentioned Dn 55 and Training and CCH Processes then the discoveries of by passed releases and F/Ns.

      Mainly the reason they can get away with this gross and flagrant *out tech* is they mostly do objectives as a co-audit.

      My personally experience when supervising co-audits is that co-auditors love to waste time if one doesn’t keep ’em on the straight and narrow.

      Also since co-auditors aren’t all that well trained they tend to miss things….

      Like the fricking EP!!!!!

      I recommend to any auditor who wants to improve their Rehab skills to sit on a co-audit 🙂

      Moving on.

      Personally I doubt if a paying HGC PC would sit still or ambulate for 500 hrs on objectives without going into protest.

      Anyway as far as I see it.

      The group agreement at the Church has created this nice lil’ world Organizational and Technically that is impervious to the actual realities.

      This is why some totally untrained moron can say with all apparent “certainty” that they are making “gains” from being overrun beyond comprehension on an objectives co-audit.

      Simple because they *believe* they are.

      Making “Scientology” as delivered by the Orgs these days just another faith based Religion or Religious Practice and not an Applied Religious Philosophy.

      • I’ll just add something I posted elsewhere on this subject:

        We have a lunatic at the wheel who doesn’t know how to drive yet is driving, and who fits nicely in this description of how tech can go bad (from Keeping Scientology Working):

        “The reasons for this are not hard to find. (a) A weak certainty that it works in Three above can lead to weakness in Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten. (b) Further, the not-too-bright have a bad point on the button Self-Importance. (c) The lower the IQ, the more the individual is shut off from the fruits of observation. (d) The service facs of people make them defend themselves against anything they confront, good or bad, and seek to make it wrong. (e) The bank seeks to knock out the good and perpetuate the bad.” LRH

        • Maybe so Chris but he isn’t the total why for the Church being FUBAR since by agreement the whole Org Board has been completely violated.

          Not to mention HCO’s responsibility to apply PTS/SP tech and remove him from post which is covered in the PL Ethics Design of.

          That said the point is just like society to a greater or lesser degree has accepted blatant out points as usual. Many while others are saying almost as a mantra “this too shall pass” in the Church have basically done the same on a microcosmic scale.

          What the shrinks call cognitive dissonance.

          Only in this case it has been created by what was called “a severe reality adjustment”.

      • Re processes run on the Grades, the EPs are often covered in the original HCOB or book given as a reference for running the process. That, along with HCOBs on End Phenomena – as well as on Flattening a Process – will serve one well when running Grades on someone.

        One other issue I have found to be a good source reference when running CCHs and objective processes is the HCOB Training And CCH Processes (1957).

        • Training and CCH Processes is a good reference. Among others such as CCHs Auditing Attitude, CCHs. Processing etc.

          However on a co-audit. One can’t expect a student co-auditor to be able to think with the data. Because they have so little data to operate with which is why co-audit supervision is so important.

          Also the student co-auditor has climbed to the levels of ability that are gradiently taught on the levels.

          • Co-audit supervision is a key element in Scientology progress, in my opinion. There are folk out in the field who could do co-audits from books and what materials they have, just as in the early days. There are vast amounts of materials for all levels in the Tech Vols. Not all PCs cog at the same rate, and so it takes a qualified C/S to understand what’s going on.

            Independent C/S’s are the crème de la crème of the human race.

            There is a huge opportunity for Tech and Qual Divs to flourish, along with Admin and Ethics advices, over the internet.

            Don’t wait for the Bridge to fall in your lap – go for it, find someone to co-audit with! You’ve read the books, you’ve been in and out of the CoS.

            Scientology and Dianetics are simple, there’s no need to get complicated.

            • Hey Poet,

              I’m all for those hardy souls picking up a book (like DMSMH for example) or even a set of tech vols and starting a co-audit like they did in the past.

              In fact I think we should encourage it.

              Yeah so there be squirrels.

              But so what.

              Ron discusses this in the RED Superior Service Image and also in the PL Ethics and Franchise.

              Back in the day when the Org introduced the squirrelly “Golden Age of Tech” there was a massive exodus by org PCs to the field.

              Some waiting the proscribed 2 years off Org Lines to get some real auditing.

              That is until Jane’s son Chaz shut it down as as I call him the Auditor DE-Activation Chief by illegally canceling all Field Auditors Certs by demanding that they “avail” themselves of the Golden Age of Tech.

              Of course their devious lil’ plan didn’t quite work out the way they expected and so….

              Here we are 🙂

              But that’s all water under the bridge which not only has its pillars gnawed on by mice but big fat rats as well.

              • I agree, RV.

                Ron tried to make it as simple as possible, with undercut after undercut, repairs if things went wrong, always supplying his reasoning so that we could understand every inch of the way what he was trying to do.

                If you’ve done TR0 to EP, you’ll know how incredible the tech is, you’ll want more, and you’ll want to do it Ron’s way.

                I have no objection to squirrels or off-beats or whatever, they’re doing what they think is right. Ron went out of his way to make sure we knew what Scientology and Dianetics was, so that it couldn’t be mistaken or fiddled with or hijacked.

                The bottom line is that the tech works – critics hate that. But not only does the tech work, it leads somewhere – tah dah! So what if there are a few SP’s on the way – nobody actually dies, LOL! Pay attention to them and you’ll spend longer in the Sin Bin – fool!

  7. Lana:

    People just coming into Scientology (the Church) today may figure that this is normal. Consider, they’ve been lied to at ever turn down the track. Virtually every “way out” they’ve been given turned out to be a lie. It wouldn’t be terribly surprising to find out that Scientology was, too. And guess what? It is a lie. Scientology as practiced in the Church is exactly that. It’s some mish-mash of lemon-lime, cola and fruit flavors with a genuine “Coca-Cola” label slapped on it. Yep, it really is that bad over there. Be thankful that we (those of us who know better) don’t have to put up with this.

    One other point. If there are no absolutes attainable in this universe, then there is always room for the improvement of our Tech. By that I don’t mean some NEW technology. I mean improvement in our ability to better deliver the Tech we have. In other words, it’s always possible to improve your auditing and C/Sing. As you continue to audit and deliver, keep that in mind and strive for it.

    Paul

  8. When I was in the church, the first process I was audited on was the final process from Grade IV. When things went awry, the auditor ended off the session in the middle of the process.

    My first ethics handling was declaring me a SP. Before that, I wasn’t on ethics lines.

    These are considered gradients in Scientology.

    I flinched so now I am permanently labelled a “a dog pc, an occluded case or a difficult pc.”

    • “Every “dog pc” investigated traced to incompetent programming, C/Sing, out TRs, bad metering, Code breaks and bad lists.

      By forcing an auditor to cool off his opinions and properly handle the pc, each one of these “dog pcs” has begun to fly.” LRH (C/S Series 80, “Dog PCs”)

      • We used to handle what other Orgs called “dog PCs” all the time at AO back in the day.

        The only real “dog PC” that actually existed was the family’s pet dog who was getting animal processes 🙂

  9. Another technology comes to mind here: the project management triangle, aka “fast, good or cheap – pick two”.

    As we know how fast is a certainly a priority (a read of any promotional materials now boasts of doing the whole Bridge in 6 months or less) and the church does not want to lose money and seem downstat by dropping its rates, then it is obvious which of the three attributes of the auditing and training technology that management is sacrificing:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_management_triangle

    • Just realized that reads a bit confusing, since what I wrote makes it seem like quality could be still intact if the price is not being sacrified (i.e. not cheap). But… then again, there are constant requests for donations to the IAS and to up one’s membership, so maybe it’s not directly related to tech, but it is certainly not cheap to be in the Church (it’s hard to afford auditing once gives to the IAS, or buys materials they don’t really need).

      Quality is certainly debatable, and in fairness, I would be curious to see auditors in the church up against independents to see whom knows the tech better not simply by rote but also in theory, can explain with ease, and of course, who can audit most effectively. As well as to see whom is succeeding in general in life.

  10. Shortness of service is a false Ideal Scene. In fact it is an out-point of omitted service.
    Having no Ideal Scene to compare the existing scene to, or having a false Ideal Scene prevents that out-points are recognized at all.
    Handling would be in the direction of creating an awareness about a correct Ideal Scene. I have people read (or listen to) LRH materials and let them look then and have them compare it to what they see or have experienced.

    • Again Worsel, I always enjoy your wisdom. Thank you for the insightful comment.

      Yes — they are missing or have a false Ideal Scene. And the handling is as you suggest. BTW – it has NOTHING to do with “Ideal Orgs” (which are struggling to pay bills, are empty and the opposite of LRH’s orgs in their day). LOL

  11. Agreed, Lana.

    What I also find sickening is that Miscavige has perverted not just the tech itself, but the entire purpose of Scientology.

    Before Miscavige, even when there were flaws in delivering the tech, the overwhelming purpose was to help the student or preclear.

    The fact that I recall the good intent of the 1970s enables me to recall an “Ideal Scene” which can rely upon to maintain a purpose to see Scientology expand. Those who came into Scientology after 1982 have not observed that good intent as a stable datum. So, when they ARCX, they do so against the entirety of the tech, not just those who pervert it and its intent.

    • Agreed A.
      I left the Sea Org after 17 years of service when I saw that the organisation I was working for, supporting and dedicated to, no longer practiced LRH’s Scientology. The underlying LRH philosophy is gone and those that enter Scn these days routinely have no idea, as all they listen to is the PR hype from DM, that is a paradox of claiming to be the route to freedom, while continually caging beings and keying them in.

      I should also note that some field auditors and groups that take LRH and mix it with other practices and R&D are also off the rails. DM is not the only squirrel in these woods — but he is the King based on the destruction he leaves in his wake.

      PS. We have a regular contributor here who uses the name 4a, so maybe to prevent confusions you should choose a new name to go by. Simply A is too close.

    • Haha – good point Sherry.

      Many of the people who I have met (who have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars in the C of S as professional preclears), are looking for that “One-Shot Clear”. They are not willing to put in the time to study and become expert auditors to deal with the reactive mind, instead waiting for their auditor to “make them Clear or OT”. The idea that they can go in session and come out OT is pushed in the PR hype from the Church.

      Clear and OT are achievable — but they require dedication, work and energy on the part of the person himself/herself. And it is such a fun journey!

      I can’t understand why some people would want to try and get the end EP without enjoying the learning, having the gains and competence that following the full Bridge gives.

      🙂

      • I make a speculative guess here, no idea how much it’s correct. They make things easy and quick because their core customers, the IAS patrons, expect it that way. They give money, they get immediate results. They are used to great locations, good service, effortless consumption, ubiquitous flattery. CofS lost the general public a long time ago and the few new publics that come in are talked into becoming staff to serve the patrons. Patrons make fake gains, staff make no gains.

        Thoughts on that?

      • “Now you take somebody, it’s very interesting watching somebody being audited on the grades who isn’t trained even in the least. They eventually come up to a level of awareness that something is going on, but they don’t have the technology to explain what is going on, and they couldn’t isolate by-passed charge for the life of ’em. They can’t, can’t isolate it. They, they know, “Now wait. Something is wrong in auditing, and something is wrong with me, and womf wonf womf wonf womf womf, and let’s see. Oh, it’d be an ARC break, PTP, what if I’d gone and missed a withhold. I’ve done something here.” He doesn’t know what to call it. He hasn’t got the, he hasn’t got the subject matter at his fingertips. He doesn’t know what to call it, so of course he can’t handle it.” LRH (Class VIII Tape 2, What Standard Tech Does)

      • “Purpose only becomes real when it gets to the blood, sweat and tears, stage, you know? You have to suffer a little bit. If there’s no suffering involved at all, nobody knows he’s experiencing anything.

        Another thing that’s quite interesting about such an activity, it always requires a certain amount of sacrifice – always requires a certain amount of sacrifice – whether of time or of personal interest or even personal possessions, some slight degree.

        A big game always requires some sacrifice.” LRH (“Today’s Battle of Britain, 8 October 1956)

  12. “It has recently come to my attention that some auditors are delivering grades in outrageously short periods of time to Dianetic Clear pcs and only giving Quad Grades to the Dianetic Clear without making full use of the Expanded Grades. Such pcs are being denied the full gains of the grade processes due to Quickie Grades—out-tech.

    In addition to the immediate abilities gained from the grades being properly delivered, having his grades really IN will prevent the pre-OT from running into difficulties on the OT levels.

    The grades are a very essential part of the Grade Chart and must not be delivered over a persistent F/N or skimped on in any way. Let’s Keep Scientology Working!” LRH (C/S Series 106, Auditing the Dianetic Clear)

  13. Re objective auditing, to be factual, there has been a lot of quickie on it. Look up the references on how long Ron says to run Book & Bottle (Op Pro by Dup) for instance. Or what he says about objectives in general. One doesn’t end an objective process on “three times flat”! :-p

  14. Well done “Martha” for seeking advice, you’ve done the right thing.

    The CoS is no longer qualified to deliver Scientology and Dianetics, no matter how well-meaning their staff appear. It’s not just a case of shoddy service, it’s an actual fraud claiming to be something it isn’t.

    I had my own 38-year experience with that organization until seven years ago, and do not recommend anyone going there for any reason – even the books are adulterated, besides being idiotically produced and over-priced.

    Maybe the CoS will one day recover, but in PT we are better off not dirtying our hands there, but instead, taking a more responsible attitude to our lives and sanity by sticking with Standard Tech practitioners (real people).

    Richard Kaminski
    Independent Scientologist UK

  15. i totally feel you on this. I too hate to see ppl being denied of what I found to be awesome. Thank god i had an auditor that ‘got it’ and was there for me until i started my OT levels. At that point I’d come to L.A. just in time for all the mission holder declares so I wasn’t keen on sticking around. Luckily I found an independent auditor and finished up. I’m totally lost on what’s going on inside that place…..dm has altered so much tech that i hardly recognize it. He’s such a parasite.

  16. As a staunch LRH techie, I hear you guys. I’m appalled at the tech degrades( also the business of waiting for an F/N to float several times before you call it etc. etc.) I told anyone who tried to “sell” me GAT not to bother, was insulting. I audited one pc the church messed up, and cringe at the denial of wins and gains the CO$ denies pcs. The declared me because I had the “gall” to audit pcs in the field, much less audit myself on Solo Nots. !!!!!!!!!! The joy an auditor receives when his pcs win is priceless! Shirley Tutuska Buffalo

  17. Lana, after overunning people on objectives they quiky them on grades. I think it’s to obey to the direction given in RJ 35 where LRH (if it was him) says that grades take a month. Who wrote the damn RJ35, which promote quiky grades, and “upper” OT level which are not existing ?
    Read it again, you’ll see, it cannot be LRH. But even independant feel outraged when somebody question the RJs. Listen also to RJ38 and tell me if you recognize LRH voice?
    The RJ are the source of lies. From 34. Tell me your view. Most of the Sea Org disagree because they were “there” and on post at this time and didn’t question it. Especially ex RTC member.
    You have been against freezoner. I was in the church but never ever believed anything uttered by RTC which for me is a suppressive group from the begining.
    Basically when you have been part of a SP group you should be sec checked on overt done with this group, and reasonableness on this group. Miscavige and Broeker (before Miscavige fire him) have invented a lot of lies (like Ron has gone to do upper research out of the body!). They created RTC without LRH agreement and they wrote false RJ with false data like grade take one month. And now they try to follow these stupid data with GAT 2, which is a complete alter is.
    Of course they do quiky grades. Many people not only had quiky grades but no grades at all. I went clear on NED before the grades so I never had grades. It was right to send me through OTIII as I was in the non interference aera but HCOB of de 1970’s says that It’s a good place to do grades after OT3 expanded.
    I think it’s also good after solo not’s. I know for exemple that I am not release from the hostilities and suffering of life.
    Many OT, I think, have simply their grades out.

    • Thanks FG. I understand your views and you are entitled to them. I worked in RTC for 6 years, so from that perspective you may very well discount any of my views. The individuals in RTC are not all suppressive — but again, you are entitled to your views. I have known and worked with more than 40 RTC staff over time and found the majority of them to be well intentioned, good people (but there were certainly several who were not). As a group, they have become suppressive. Their product is an overt act and destructive to the very purpose they were supposed to be accomplishing.

      Yes you are right about Quickie Grades.

      No – I am not against Freezoners – I am just for standard tech, and in my experience there is a significant percentage of Freezoners who engage in anything but.

      LRH’s original OT IV included completion of any earlier Grade Chart steps that had not been done (for whatever reason), and yes, this can be done after SOLO NOTs completion.

      Thanks for your views.

  18. Hello Lana,

    I didn’t say that RTC people were SP. Of course not! Only Miscavige and some few.
    My point is that the RJ from 34 are false, not written nor said by LRH. It was a very strong perception.
    I just said that people from RTC could be reasonnable as they have been on the wrong side of the truth.
    I was also on the church as a public (and also an auditor I’m class 5 grad) and I had to endure this doubt, hiding it on sec checksto not be stop on OT levels.
    I did up to New OTVIII back to 1989. I strongly believe that New OTVIII is not an OT level. It’s the first false one. The further “OT level” never came by lack of imagination of technical team!
    LRH never lied so why would he advertise OT level (IX to XV) which are not existing? I also found it strange to say that it takes a month to do all grades. The writer paid by Miscavige to write RJ 35 didn’t know much of tech.
    And oddly enough I said this to Mike Rinder and he said that LRH was the author of those RJ and it was his voice on RJ38. And for me it cannot be.
    But if what I say is true and known by scientologists it might be enough to overthrow Miscavige
    Yes I know the OTIV RD which is to be done after solo not’s. It catch up any missing part of the grade chart. I studied it.
    I believe I really need the grades and I’m sure it will be great.

    Lana, I read a lot of bad things about you and your group on many blogs. They identify you with the church of Miscavige.
    But you still try to make scientology a reality.
    Thank you for it..

  19. @FG – I’m a little confused. The COS seems to say one can do a grade in 5 hours each (per the main article by Lana) yet you’re saying the tapes of RJ 34+ states a month on each grade, which would seem inconsistent with what is claimed. Not going to get into debate of legitimacy of the tape, but it would seem that if the tape is real then even the COS is cheating there, or am I misunderstanding what you wrote?

    Also, which blogs state that MS2 is the same as COS?

    Re: Rinder, I would look over his track record of honesty on prior claims to see how truthful he’s been, as he was known to lie on staff as well per his own admissions – so how do you know it’s truthful now?

    Sorry I feel like a lot of data is not clear here for us readers to understand what is being mentioned in a roundabout way.

    On the plus side, glad that you are questioning things though the trick to being successful at finding truth is to remain as objective as possible and be willing to adapt a view if new data comes to light.

  20. In RJ 35, you’ll see if you can find it that it says that ALL the grades can be done in one month. If you look at the process sheet of the grades, it is not possible without to do quikie.

    • Thanks FG for the reference.

      In terms of RJs, don’t these stand for “Ron’s Journals” which are mainly a recollection of and reflection on recent events in the world and in the group? My point being here that I’m not sure it is policy to go by RJ anything.

      As far as I understand, HCOPL (Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letters) would dictate the length with HCOB being more in detail (and somewhat 2nd in rank of importance). If I am wrong, please guide me to a reference otherwise.

      Whomever is using RJ 35 in that case would be using the wrong source as a policy if trying to get all grades done in a month. (This does not mean it couldn’t be done for some people, but not all will have the end phenomenon and results that quickly).

    • “The third level, consisting of the lower Grades and more
      books could, due to scheduling of time and all that, consume
      a month.” RJ 35

      I would think it depends on a number of factors, including that the case was properly set up; wasn’t a bypassed case; was full-time (which can be assumed in the above excerpt from RJ35), and that the auditor knows his/her stuff. If one considers that a Grade would take somewhere around 25 hours, perhaps 37 1/2, then one could get five Grades done in about a month, perhaps 6 weeks. It would go faster as well if the pc was trained on the Academy Levels. The point being, each case runs differently, but it could be done within a month or two, full-time, no distractions.

  21. Possibly Grades could be done in a month. Depending…
    But my point is that RJ 35 has not been written by Hubbard as it promotes OT levels which don’t exist. When Hubbard promoted something it exists. The ink was not even dry that Not’s was delivered in Flag.
    OT9 is expected for almost 30 years. Therefore it doesn’t exist. So Hubbard who was honest couldn’t have promoted something not existing so he couldn’t have written RJ 35.
    Want to pull more strings?

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